i have been reading about carl jung and the archtypes from the collective unconscious.. i think it very benificial to fantasize or imagine your own personal guru,, to guide you through life,,to have genuine coversations with this mythological figure of your imagination.
i feel such a figure can grow to be quite an asset in dealing with your lifes problems.
they say there are 12 basic types or archtypes,,have any here tried this approach?
the best teachers, inside your mind our apparently outside are those who can show you that you never needed one
-Anthony De Mello
a Teacher educates, A shepherd on the other hand enslaves and manipulates for his own benefit... he fleeces and slaughters his flock, never expects them to become shepherds.
personally, i could care less about god and/or jesus, have no use for either of them, very disappointed in how they run things.
and when i die, i hope i get the chance to tell him/them that.. there was a great song in the late 80's early 90's by depeche mode called blasphemous rumours(spelling ?
) "i don't want to start any blasphemous rumours, but i think that god has a sick sense of humour, and when i die i expect to find him laughing.".
I have come to believe that it is impossible for something to arise from nothing, which means that everything that is has always been and shall always be, it just changes form and relationships.... I find that any part of the whole claiming to be God independant of the whole is just insanity or fraud, not divinity...even if some parts have god-like abilities... after all if an alien species did come here and pretended to be god[s] in ancient times, who would be able to despute their higher technology and claim they were not gods?
the fact that the bible god's followers call him their shepherd smacks of an unconscious understanding that they are being manipulated, fleeced and slaughtered for this being's benefit.
I have come to see that the ultimate, the whole, the absolute reality of which we are all parts, can be viewed as GOD, or the Generator Of Diversity... but this did not give us life, it is what we are... there is no point in worshipping it as it is us all... and a better course would be mutual respect and acceptance as all are part of this one whole, we are all part of each other, to harm another is to harm oneself.... this is the mystical oneness that all ancient mystics seem to point to...and what I believe is meant by Paul when he says in HIM we live and move and have our being [Acts 17:28] and what the authors meant when they have Jesus saying he wants all his disciples to be ONE [realize the oneness] as he and his father [read source of being] are one. [john 17:11,21]
i notice the most qouted parts by the wts is the ot and the epistles .
all there rules are reinforcements of what is already there.
infact the letters to the early congregations are very watchtowerish.
I'm not a JW, but I know that truth is out there, and I know I am exposed to the fullness of it, even though I may not understand it all
you KNOW? I believe, that is the first lie most people tell themselves, they claim to KNOW what they only believe.... what does "to KNOW" really mean? To me it means by direct experience... to claim to KNOW something you have never directly experienced is a lie... the other meaning of KNOW is to understand.... you may be claiming that you UNDERSTAND that the truth is out there... but is that a valid statement? out where? the ONLY things I believe we know are our own mental symbols, our own mapping of a world we have never and will never directly expeirence as our direct experiences are shielded from such a thing... our direct expeirences seem to be of only what our own minds invent... a dream about reality which may or may not be based on reality. Movies like the 13th floor and the MATRIX illustrate that what we think we know about reality may not be real, but something far different invented by means we have no way to detect from inside.... Plato spoke of this as the shadows on the wall mistaken for the realities causing them... Paul spoke of seeing reality in a distorted mirror...
I believe there is an objective reality, but I also believe no one can ever verify it as the only thing we are able to know is our own view... we assume if others agree with us that makes it a verification, but the catch is, those "others" are also within your own mind, possibily invented by your own mind and their opinion is no greater than your own by itself.
i notice the most qouted parts by the wts is the ot and the epistles .
all there rules are reinforcements of what is already there.
infact the letters to the early congregations are very watchtowerish.
Christianity is flawed, especially Pauline Christianity. But I think that it is superior to the pagan practices of Rome (at the time) and therefore represents a step forward in mankind's spiritual evolution. Through Pauline Christianity, we are introduced to a Creator. We meet a symbol of perfection. We form a concrete idea of morality. We learn to respect other human beings. Racism is overthrown (a BIG Imperial Roman concept). Violence is abhorred. Judgement is often left to God, especially of those outside the Christian community. Evangelism is encouraged.
all these concepts and more were part of the pagan mystery school teachings long before the Jesus myth was invented as a jewish verision of the same hero with a thousand faces... which to the initiated is a symbol of your own spirit, your own connection to the divine, your oneness and wholeness hidden from the uninitiated by many layers of false beliefs....gnosis.
i notice the most qouted parts by the wts is the ot and the epistles .
all there rules are reinforcements of what is already there.
infact the letters to the early congregations are very watchtowerish.
THE JESUS MYSTERIES
presents a different view of history and backs it up with more than öthodox christians ever could...
thesis: Paul was a gnostic who adapted the pagan mysteries [ancient dramas taught to intiates in several steps] which was later abused by the roman church to suit its own propaganda ends.... letters like Timothy and the Thessolians were written by the church in later times to make Paul seem anti-gnostic.
Jesus never existed as a real person according to this view, but was the symbolic godman myth of all ancient mystery schools with a new name.... the four levels of initiation are EARTH-- the myths are believed by the ignorant to be actual history. WATER-- still viewed as historical, the symbolism is explained. [to you I explain clearly, for them it is only parables]. AIR-- they symbology is received to be the critical components and the historical is revealled to be non-existant and irrelevant. and finally FIRE-- the person acheived gnosis, a direct experience of their oneness with the divine, they no longer needed any one to point for them, no longer required any tutor, but the law was now written in their heart by the spirit....
The baptism into his death, represented the initiate dying to his former point of view and being reborn as a new being with new vision... the former things have passed away... he has now become heir of GOD and joint heir with Christ... he has become ONE with GOD as Jesus and GOD were one... the mystical union.... in HIM we live and move and have our being --acts 17:28.
reading through some of the recent posts, ie; the topic of lazarus and the gay issue, i was flabbergasted at what i was reading.
i can't believe-well maybe i can, that some people on this site are calling gay people "faggots", and telling that person that they are going to get "what sodom and gomorrah got".. this site has been a godsend to me, and have been telling my friends how nice it is to be in with a group of people who can relate to my life, my feelings, my insecurities, and my fears relating to the org.
and not being a part of it anymore.
THICHI: Zen, Are you claiming Evil does not exist? No values? one big free-for-all?
Values are subjective depending upon goals... I am sure my heaven would be Elle McPheirson[?]'s hell ...
we all compare reality to our goals and judge anything defeating them as bad while anything supporting or exceeding them as good... and we are all different and have different ideas about what those things are.... the claim of the religious is that God knows best for all and his view of good and bad should be the final authority.... Some claim this based on the supposed attribute of God known as omniscience.... but I find most arguments along these lines only show any god that may exist to be either insane or worse.
reading through some of the recent posts, ie; the topic of lazarus and the gay issue, i was flabbergasted at what i was reading.
i can't believe-well maybe i can, that some people on this site are calling gay people "faggots", and telling that person that they are going to get "what sodom and gomorrah got".. this site has been a godsend to me, and have been telling my friends how nice it is to be in with a group of people who can relate to my life, my feelings, my insecurities, and my fears relating to the org.
and not being a part of it anymore.
the stronger one holds their own ideal fantasy as THE WAY, the GOOD, the BEST, and all else as imperfect, false, flawed, etc... the more they will feel justified in trying to rid the world of the "evil" which harms their ideals....
this is also true for all of those who feel justified in name calling those who are bigots and haters of homosexuals.... why is one form of hate ok but another form not?
until people wake up to the realization that we are all one system and all hatred is self hatred, it will not end... it will only shift who can justify their hatreds.
its hard to get out of this good vs evil mentality, its so ingrained and brainwashed into us that most cannot even fathom that you can exist without such judgements.... few can truly accept the perfection of each and every moment... but reality is not imperfect until you compare it to something it is not.... meditate on it
hebrews 5: 11-13
11we have much to say about this, but it is hard to explain because you are slow to learn.
12in fact, though by this time you ought to be teachers, you need someone to teach you the elementary truths of god's word all over again.
What seeps out via the subtext of all of this is the contempt the boys in Brooklyn have for the average dub's intelligence and the general level of spirituality of their flock.
I used to think this until I accomplied the ex on one of her bible studies with a young gal named mary anne.... sweet, gal, dumb as a turnip...
we would read: Jehovah is the name of God.... question: what is the name of God? and she would sit there stupified and truly not get it. and I remember thinking how could these questions get more simple...but there are really people out there that need things spoon fed to them and that is why they are called sheep... one of the dumbest animals on earth... .the way I figure it, anyone with a few lose neurons can figure out the JW con eventually and either leave, get the boot or take advantage and become leaders in the movement.... they actively seem to weed out anyone with a questioning mind despite the borean horse $#!+
does anyone know what beth means in the bible?
we have different names such as bethlehem and bethel and then we have the society's old building which was beth-sarim.
does beth mean something and if so does anyone know?
there is NO meaning OF life, there is only meaning found by the living....
it comes from awareness that your actions have consequences.
hello, this is my first post.
i hope i will receive some answers to my question.
the lord jesus christ rose from the dead to die no more.
JWs have a very real blindspot when it comes to ressurection.... they are told by the GB that when a person dies, its over, they no longer exist in any way shape or form, but only as a memory in the mind of God.... no soul, as the soul is the entire living person and is as dead as the deased... no spirit, as the spirit is just a force that keeps one alive like electricity, it has no personality no memories, no consciousness...etc.
this presents a real problem which JWs fail to see....they assume a continuity between the once living and the ressurected person... yet they have no theory, nor mechanism to account for this continuity. the only thing that the raised person has is the pattern and memories of the original...and there is nothing that make it more than a COPY....
consider this... since pattern and memory are both data stored in the mind of God and God could, if he wanted to, use that pattern to make the very copy of you right this moment, there is nothing that makes that new person you... nothing that links its consciousness with your own, you KNOW it is not you...because YOU are over here and he is over there.... so by what magic does it become you just because you die? if it exists prior to your death, you will not magically become that one when you die....so why would you become that one if he is made after you? there is no fundamental difference...nothing linking the new consciousness to the old at all....the old person is dead and the new one is not him.
taking this to an extreme, you are not the same person who went to bed last night, he is part of the dead past and you are a new collection of matter and energy... what links you to that one? why are you condemned for his sins? if there is no soul or spirit which is the real person, the consciousness that experiences all things, then we are just robots and there is no reason to condemn the current configuration of matter and energy for what a past configuration did, as a simple update can fix that.
so who rose from the dead? if Jesus was a real human being who died.... and god invented a spirit being out of the ashes, its not even the same pattern of matter and energy, it could have the same memories, but so what? why is this new invented being Jesus? why should it be granted godhood for what his clone donor did?
